When Your Life's Work Gets Voted Out

Sherry McIntyre on Reinvention and Retirement.

A single vote can erase a program overnight, even if it shaped a whole community for decades. That’s what happened to Sherry McIntyre, a Modesto, California teacher who spent 25 years teaching a World Religions class that was required for graduation in public school, a “first and only” experiment in religious literacy at that scale. When the school board moved to phase it out to make room for a required Ethnic Studies course, the loss wasn’t just curricular, it was personal.

We sit with the tension that makes conversations about religion in schools so loaded and so necessary: how do you teach about faith traditions while honoring the First Amendment and keeping the classroom safe for everyone? Sherry’s answer is simple and hard to execute: Teach, not preach. She shares what changed for students when they replaced ignorance with knowledge, how the course held steady even in the 9/11 aftermath, and why she believes understanding world religions helps teens interpret conflict without defaulting to stereotypes.

Then we widen the lens to midlife transition and retirement identity. If you’re known for one thing and that thing disappears, who are you next? Sherry talks about grief, courage, saying yes, mentoring other teachers, and stepping into a third act that includes travel and finally writing the book she’s been carrying for years. If you’re staring down a career change, a forced pivot, or a door that just slammed shut, this conversation offers a practical way forward: find the window, and climb.

If it resonates, subscribe, share it with a friend in transition, and leave a review so more people can find The Mango Times.
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Guest Information
Sherry McIntyre is a longtime educator, thoughtful communicator, and TEDx Modesto speaker who has spent decades helping students wrestle with big ideas, questions, and worldview. As she steps into a new season beyond the classroom, Sherry brings wisdom, curiosity, and a candid perspective on identity, purpose, and what it means to navigate life when one chapter ends and another begins.

Resources and Links
Sherry's TEDx Talk:  Dreams, World Peace and Freshman

Music used in this episode:
All music in this episode is licensed for use through Epidemic Sound.

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Transcript

When The Work Gets Taken Away

Fletch 0:06

For 25 years, she showed up. Every period, every school day, teaching something that most people were afraid to even touch. She didn't just build a career, she built something the whole country was watching. And then there was a school board vote. And just like that, it was done. Today's conversation is about what you do when the thing you built gets taken away. Hey, welcome back to the Mango Times, where we like to talk about adventure in midlife. This is your host, Fletch. And today's story isn't just a transition story. It's about identity, it's about legacy, and it's about what happens when an institution decides that your life's work is no longer a requirement. My guest today is Sherry McIntyre. She's been a teacher at Johansson High School in Modesto, California, since 2000. She's been a TEDx speaker. She was featured in The Anecdote on Amazon Prime, Faith Ed and Teaching About Religion. She's a woman who has taught tens of thousands of Modesto kids that fear comes from ignorance and that knowledge is her. I met Sherry almost 10 years ago on the stage at TEDx Modesto when I was emptying the event. And I really think you're going to like today's interview. It's a perfect crossroads for the Mango Times podcast where requirement, midlife shifts, a change in plans all come together in one interview. So let's not waste any time. Let's head into the studio for this interview where Sherry joined me on a Zoom conversation to talk about each one of these points.

From NASA Secretary To Teacher

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

Fletch 2:08

So our story goes back quite a bit, but can you give a brief bio to our listeners about who you are?

SPEAKER_02 2:16

Of course. I grew up in the Bay Area, hating school. And after I graduated from high school, I was a secretary. I actually was spent a couple years as a secretary at NASA, at NASA Ames Research Center at Moffat Field. And it was a I just decided I wanted to be a teacher. I had a dream that I was in a classroom. And when I woke up, it felt very positive. So I decided that being a teacher was something that I wanted to pursue, but I hadn't even gone to college. So college, working full-time, two babies, and a husband, and more babies to come. So I kept going to school. I finished college and I began my teaching career and have been teaching for 29 years.

Fletch 3:07

And briefly, why don't you tell people how we bumped into each other?

SPEAKER_02 3:11

I was approached in, I suppose it was 2016, to be to be part of a TED talk experience that was going to be held in Modesto in our hometown. And I have a really bad habit of saying yes to everything. It's my my theory is if you say yes, you can change your mind and say no. But if you say no, you can't change your mind and say yes, usually. So my say yes kind of kicked in and I said, of course. And I it was just an email. And I didn't know this person and I didn't know if it was even real, but I thought, okay, whatever. And after uh after that first contact, it was a little while, maybe a month or two. And he contacted me again and said, let's talk about what you're gonna your talk's gonna be about. And I thought, oh, isn't he cute? He's he's it's acting like it's really gonna happen. Because of course it won't, right? This is not gonna really and he emailed me again and said, Can we meet and go over what your talk is looking like that you're writing? And I thought, oh crap. He really he's really meaning to do this. I better write something. I still didn't believe it was really gonna happen. So we met at Starbucks and we went over my talk. I liked him. I thought, okay, this is a nice guy. But I still, if you'd asked me to place bets, I still wouldn't have thought this was really gonna happen. But time wore on and eventually we got down to the big, you know, we're getting ready for the big day, and the all the speakers were set, and we had a dinner at my house so that we could all get together and just meet each other and kind of form a little family bond kind of thing. And you were introduced as the MV for the evening, that you would be meeting each of us individually to get to know us a little bit, so that when you introduced each of us at the event, it would be more natural. And that's how you and I met. And the TED Talk experience did happen, and it was one of the most frightening things I think I've ever done. I remember standing backstage while the person who went right before me was on stage and I could see her from the wings, and I was standing there looking at her, and then looking behind me at the exit, fire exit, and thinking, I could leave. I I could I could just leave. I could do this because I was determined to do this by memory. No cards, no notes, just like 19 minutes of talking. And I thought, what if I freeze? What if I don't know what to say? What if I and then you introduced me and I was like, okay, here I go. Guess

Making World Religions A Requirement

SPEAKER_02 5:46

I'm doing this.

Fletch 5:46

Well, I'm glad you didn't take the exit. Yeah, that's that's good. So I loved that story, but why don't you take me back to 2000? And the story is about a world religions class. How does that even happen in a public school in Modesto, which, Sherry, let's be honest, this is not exactly known as the hotbed of religious pluralism.

SPEAKER_02 6:10

It's considered the Central Valley is often seen as the Bible belt of California. And yes, that's absolutely correct. People think of California as in one way, but here in the Central Valley, it it's quite different in many ways. So that's right. Well, I was a teacher for two years at a junior high at Laloma Junior High here in town. And then I transferred to Johansson. We were overstaffed, and I was the newest staff member. So I had to move. I went to Johansson to teach freshmen. I did that for one year. Behind the scenes, the social studies teachers were already developing this course, and the goal was for it to begin the fall of 2000. And this was the school year of 99, 2000, that was my first year at Johansson. And I was approached towards the end of the school year by a couple of teachers who were working on developing the course, and they said, We're developing this world religions course, which I had heard about. And they said, We know you have a social studies credential, and we would like for you to teach the course. And I here at Johansson, and I thought, oh my gosh, yeah, that sounds wonderful. Of course I'll do that. All of the high schools offered it. Well, they didn't offer it, it required it. It be it was a requirement for graduation. And it was the first and was never, nobody ever did it again. No other school district anywhere in the nation ever copied us and made it a requirement for graduation. You can find world religions courses as electives in public schools, you can find it as maybe a requirement in a private school, but a requirement in a public school for graduation, Modesto City Schools was the first and only. To my knowledge, no one has done it again.

Fletch 7:59

So uh if I remember correctly, the course was started because if I if I remember the story, there was a gay student who was being bullied, and the superintendent was called the First Amendment Center and was looking for a teacher to step up, and you were the one.

SPEAKER_02 8:17

Well, that this all happened before me. The the student with the with the the issue at their school happened I'm not sure how long before me, but years before before me. And what came out of that was the the character education program fundamentally, other things as well. But the the First Amendment Center helped develop a character education program with the English teachers. And that was really my first year as a teacher at Laloma. I was, they asked who wants to help develop this character ed, and I raised my brand new little teacher hand and said, I'll I'll help. And all I really did was come up with a couple of quotes to go on the posters. But my name is on there, and that was kind of cool. So when the social studies teachers were then asked to bring something to the party, like, what can you do to help develop this character that we need to develop more with our high school students? The social studies teachers said, How about a world religions class? And this was all still before my

Teach Not Preach After 9/11

SPEAKER_02 9:22

time.

Fletch 9:22

So there was a mantra you had that was teaching, not preaching. Correct. So what did that look like in a classroom in Modesto in 2001?

SPEAKER_02 9:31

In when we started in the fall of 2000, teach not preach was something that we just sort of, it just sounded right. And we just came up with it. The idea that that we were gonna be teaching about religion, not preaching at all, that there's a big difference between the two. And we we taught our first year. We were very proud of ourselves. And we got together at the beginning of our second year to pat ourselves on the back, um, you know, talk about whether we were gonna make any changes for our second year. We were very proud of ourselves. No, nobody had complained, there had been no controversy, just some really good press, even nationwide, even in the first year. And so we started our second year feeling pretty, pretty positive. And a week after the first day of school was 9-11. So we got back together and said, Oh my gosh, what do we do? What do we change anything? And we really just decided no. What we were doing was right, it was good, it was well done, and there was no reason to do anything different, just go forward. And we ended our second year the same way we ended our first year. I like to think that we helped some in in a small way help get through that difficult time because we ended our second year with no complaints and no controversy, and that's saying a lot given the climate at the time.

Fletch 10:55

Yeah, and I remember you in even in the intro, I'd said something about you saying that fear really comes from ignorance. So when you were teaching, when did you first see this class actually work? Or, you know, when did you actually move the needle on a kid?

SPEAKER_02 11:12

You know, I don't you don't always know what's going on with them individually. Sometimes they'll come up and talk to you about how they feel. But I think when I really when I really realized how much of a difference it was making is when I was featured in a in a documentary and the film crew was filming my students, interviewing them. And they asked me to not be in the room because they didn't want the students to feel pressured to say anything because I was there, but I could be in the hall watching on the camera what the of the interview. And as I was watching on the camera, them asking students about their feelings about people of other religions before the course and then now during the course. And I saw students talking about so honestly about their prejudice before and how ashamed they were about how they used to treat other people and how they see things differently now. And it all those great moments ended up in the documentary as well. But I think that's when it really hit me.

Fletch 12:21

So at this time, I mean, this is fundamentally a shift in how they were teaching world religions. Did you know that it was something remarkable?

SPEAKER_02 12:33

I did simply because I knew who I was working with. I knew the other teachers, I knew the people who had developed the course, I knew how passionate they were about people being treated with respect and kindness. And ultimately, that's really what the course is about, is about treating each other with kindness and respect through the lens of world religions, through the lens of understanding each other's differences in a religious sense. And I and I I saw that. I saw how important it was. I mean, we had really, we had academic excuses for the class. Like if it forget the the touchy-feely, everybody needs to like each other. Just like as a teacher, as a sophomore teacher, teaching world history, as a junior teacher, teaching US history, it's it's nice to have the freshmen have learned already about world religions so that when they get to world history in 10th grade, teachers don't have to stop and teach about Buddhism, about Islam, about Christianity. They don't have to do that. It's been done. And then when they get to US history, the Puritans, people they already understand what drew people to the new world, some of them. And it was just a nice preparation for the rest of their social studies in high school. So you could look at it as a real academic, but I our goal really was more about the kids learning to be kinder to each other, ultimately.

Fletch 14:00

So I want to ask one more question on this time of your life. You I feel like having lived in the area at that time, this may not have been received. So did you have any palpable pushback while you were teaching?

SPEAKER_02 14:16

There was no complaints, no angry parents. We were ready. We had they had prepared a brochure explaining the course, explaining the goals, you know, like literally a brochure. And like back to school night, that first year, we had handfuls ready. And nobody complained. Everybody was just smiling and happy. And we would at back to school night, I would explain the course, and parents would sit there and nod and smile and say, This is great. And that was the that was true for 25 years. Every back to school night, parents nodding, smiling, in complete agreement, saying they wish they could take the class. They remember taking it in college. It's so great that it's in high school, just always positive, at least in my experience. And I never heard about anything in the district. None of the other teachers ever came back with a horror story. We always had positive experiences.

The Vote That Phased It Out

Fletch 15:13

In May 2023, the school board voted to phase out the required course. Walk me through that moment for you.

SPEAKER_02 15:21

It was a long, sad death. I knew it was coming. I knew for we knew for years that the ethnic studies course was being working its way through legislation, working its way to the governor's desk for signature. I know that in order to fit a semester course into the students' required courses, something has to go. It's not like they have an empty semester sitting there with nothing to do. So I I attended every task force I could to first it was to try and save the course, then it was to be a witness to its death because I could see it was happening. And there was no way I was gonna let it die alone. I was gonna be right there in the room with it, and I was there every every second.

Fletch 16:10

So it didn't blindside you. But you you called this one of the jewels in your crown. So what did it feel like to watch that jewel get set aside?

SPEAKER_02 16:21

It was heartbreaking. I could see a way around losing the class. I tried to convince people that to see my point of view, to see the way that it could be done. I wanted to see a world religions and ethics studies course. Like let's let's let's put them together. Better yet, let's just call it kindness, because really that's what it's about. Whether we're teaching world religions or whether we're teaching ethnic studies, the goal is that we see each other in a kinder way and that we treat each other with kindness. It's the same course, and I came to see it that way, but I didn't see the need to remove one for the other. I didn't see why it couldn't be brought together as one amazing, beautiful course. And it was sad to see it go.

Fletch 17:12

So, how about in real time? I mean, I know you and I know your passion for this. You've said maybe there were tears. How about in real time for you?

SPEAKER_02 17:20

Oh, big time. I cried at I went to the school board meeting and I got up and spoke. And uh I I had a couple of other people who had a stake in it. They came and spoke, another teacher. There were only two of us left from the first day. And so she and I both went to the school board. The president of the Interfaith Council came to speak. Stanislaus County Interfaith Council, he came to speak in support of it. And so did a lot of other people. And and it was sad to watch the vote happen. And I just I don't know. It was a it was a very sad moment. Still sad when I think about it, too hard.

Fletch 17:59

Here's a harder question, maybe, and you can choose to answer it. Sherry, do you think they were wrong?

SPEAKER_02 18:05

Absolutely. One thousand percent. One thousand percent they were wrong. There were ways to to make it work, to to fulfill the legal requirement of the ethnic studies class and to keep our beautiful world religions class. They just didn't, for whatever reason, that wasn't the agenda.

Fletch 18:24

And that's not you wanting to keep promoting your baby. That's a topic. Yeah, that's a topic that you just think is vitally important for high schoolers.

SPEAKER_02 18:35

1000%. Uh it's it if you're and and I love the ethnic studies course. I'm teaching it in my last year as a teacher. I am I I had to stop teaching what I have been teaching for 25 years and become a brand new teacher for my last year because I'm retiring next month. And so this year I've taught the ethnic studies class. And the more I teach it, because it's a semester class, we teach it once and then we teach it a second time. This is the second time around now. And I see such I it's like the same class. It's it's really all about seeing the the person across the room not as other, not as different, not as less or more, but equal and to be respected and to be treated with kindness and to be brought into the party to have a voice. I used to teach my students in world religions that the smallest voice needs to be heard. We need to stand up for each other. And the same thing is true in ethnic studies. As a matter of fact, I taught the First Amendment in World Religions, and I teach the First Amendment again in ethnic studies because the message is the same. It's just the vehicle, whether it's world religions or ethnic studies, is what has changed. And I thought it would have been wonderful if we could have like talked about all those things instead of one instead of the other.

Fletch 19:56

So podcasts are evergreen. They'll they'll last on the internet for a while, at least, right? But let's really anchor this in time. How important is this class in 2026 as we look at governments warring with each other between Western and Middle East?

SPEAKER_02 20:15

Aaron Powell the River in South America. But yeah, especially given the age that it was being taught. These kids were 14, 15 years old, freshmen. Before they have formed any, before they have taken on any opinions of other people, before they really even learned much about the world, what they think about the world themselves personally, I always just felt that it was really nice to bring to the party, to bring to the conversation the voice of as many different perspectives when it comes to religion as possible, so that as they look at the world, as they see conflict, they can start to see this group hates that group, but we're all the same. And so what's the real reason? It it can't really be about the different sacred texts you read. It really can't be. It has to be something more than that. Because by the time we were done with the world religions class, my goal was for them to see how much more alike we all were than different. So if I hate you because of your religion, the truth is probably something else. And that's where war comes in because I just think it's more complicated than religion. I know it is.

Fletch 21:33

Well, that's great. We're we're gonna take a break right here, take a little break from that heavy question, and I want to talk a little bit about identity when we come back.

Listener Note And How To Write In

Fletch 21:44

Hey, I just want to jump in the middle of this interview to share a little listener feedback. This one came in from Pete Swanberg. He was on episode 54. The title was called Living in Crescendo, and it's about Pete's story of transitioning from elementary and high school. Classrooms where he taught adapted PE to creating an international, special needs sports collective that brings inclusion to life through play. Uh, Pete had this to say. Hey Fletch, just wanted to tell you how much I've been enjoying the podcast. You've got a great mix of humor and curiosity that makes every episode feel easy to listen to, but still really engaging. You ask thoughtful questions, you keep things moving, and somehow you always bring out the best stories from your guests. Also, your guest lineup is seriously impressive. It's clear you put a lot of intention behind who you bring on. Keep it up. It's a great lesson, and I'm looking forward to what's next. Hey Pete, thank you so much for taking the time to write into the Mango Times, and thanks for the words of encouragement. That means the most to me. And for the rest of you, if you'd like to write in, you can do it a couple of ways. You can scroll down in your notes, you can send me a text or a voicemail, or you can hear your voice on the Mango Times, you can write a review over at Apple Podcasts, or you can do what Pete did and head over to themangotimes.com and hit the Let's Connect button and send me a message that way as well. You know, feedback from my audience is really what keeps this show going. If you have something you'd like to say, if you have some words of critique, or if you have someone that you think would be a great guest on the Mango Times, do me a favor and connect with me. I'd love to hear from you. Alright, let's get back to the interview.

Who Are You Without The Title

Fletch 23:39

Alright, we're back. We're talking to Sherry McIntyre about her career in teaching. And as we kind of move through this, you've been the world religions teacher for 25 years, ethnic studies, students recognize you in grocery stores. Your work's been in books, it's been in documentaries. Like you've said, you've had a TEDx talk, you've been on CBS. Who are you, Sherry, when the title is gone?

SPEAKER_02 24:07

You know, that's something that's been going through my mind quite a lot these last, it's been hitting me harder the last couple of weeks. It's funny that you even ask that because I was I was getting kind of emotional, kind of getting weepy, and I looked at my husband and said, Who am I? Who who am I gonna be? When I walk out of the classroom on May 29th for the last time, who am I? And I realized that what I need to start seeing this life experience as the teaching experience was teaching me who I am, and now it's my turn to take that whole show on the road. I'm no longer going to be tied to the classroom. I can I can branch out more, I can spread this idea beyond my classroom. And so that's that's sort of the direction that I'm thinking. I'm not sure exactly how to do that, except that I do plan on writing a book. That's that is something that I have thought about my entire life, really, but now instead of saying I'm going to, I am going to actually do it. Where that takes me, I'll just see. I'm not sure. Who knows?

Fletch 25:18

So you still have the Interfaith Council, the Cower Foundation, Brandon University. Is that enough or does it feel like a completely different shape to you?

SPEAKER_02 25:28

Well, I'm I'm also on the Stanislaus County Interfaith Council. So I get, I get my my fill of camaraderie with faith leaders. I represent the idea of education, religious education. So I don't really I don't represent a faith on the board. I represent the idea of world religions. And so that's that's kind of nice. That gives me that gives me a lot of nourishment in the field that I'm so passionate about. I I think what I would love to do is get out there and talk about what I've done, talk about maybe teach how to teach. I've had many teachers over the years contact me from other from all around the world asking me how to teach world religions. And I mentored a few of them and helped them create and develop a course. There was there's one in Bend, Oregon. A gentleman, a teacher there contacted me during COVID and he said, I have this crazy idea. I want to teach world religions. I looked it up, I found you. Could you help me? And I said, sure. And so I shared everything with him. I talked with him for a long time. We worked together. He presented it. They okayed two periods for him to teach it. And a year later, I emailed him and said, How did it go? And he said, Next year, my entire load, it every period is world religions. It was such a hit. All the kids want to take it. And I thought, oh, that's all that's so awesome. So as an elective, not a requirement, but it it I would love to do stuff like that.

Fletch 27:06

Well, you're hitting a couple of the themes we talk about here on the Mango Times. One is curiosity in the second half of life, and that permission to not have it all figured out yet. So a quick question. As you're looking at this wide open landscape, uh, has anything surprised you uh about this transition emotionally, not logistically?

SPEAKER_02 27:32

Every teacher looks forward to winter break, spring break, summer break, so that they don't have to get up and drag themselves in there and deal with all the things teachers deal with on a daily basis. It's not that we don't love being a teacher, it's just that that break replenishes our energy and and brand builds our passion back up. The the absence makes the heart drive harder, right? Now I'm looking at it being a permanent break. So I think keeping myself open to the possibilities, kind of saying, okay, universe, bring it on. What what am I supposed to do now? What direction am I gonna take this? I feel like I've I have credibility and credentials, and I think that I have something to say. So I'm just kind of I'm just gonna start writing and and contacting people and saying, hey, I'm retired. If if you need anything, let me know, and we'll just see where what direction I get sent.

Fletch 28:41

What are you saying yes to now that you couldn't when you were in the classroom every single period?

SPEAKER_02 28:48

Yeah. The ability to go s like physically go somewhere. If somebody says we would like you to come here and and teach our teachers how to do this, I can say yes. If I want to go to a conference, I can say yes. These are all very practical, but I think also it will give me the time to focus on creating the third chapter of my life. I like I've all I've I've recently, I think it was Jane Fonda who said she sought her life in chapters or even acts. The first 30 years, you're developing, you're growing up, you're figuring out who you are, and all that stuff. And the second 30 years, you're fine-tuning it, you're you're becoming better at what you do, you're raising your family, you're all that. And then your last 30 years, or hopefully more, is where it's really all about you. You get to just enjoy, you get to reap the benefits of your hard work, you get to pick the things that you really want to zoom in on and focus in on, and and just get a really narrow focus, and it's all about you. And when I turned 60 three years ago, I decided that this is it. This is my final act, and I was seeing retirement coming close, and I thought, this is it. I am I'm gonna spend this final act taking everything that I've learned about life and figuring out a way to pass it on.

Fletch 30:19

So I saw you on stage at TEDx. I mean, the luxury was that was in Modesto, so you didn't actually have to travel for that one. You're in this documentary on Amazon Prime. So Richard Rohr is a Catholic teacher, and he talks about what you just said about these third acts in life, and he talks about falling upward. Is there a version of Sherry McIntyre who wasn't tethered to the classroom that's just been waiting to come out?

SPEAKER_02 30:47

Oh, absolutely. I I remember watching my parents retire and like like they took the phrase retire way too literally. Like they sat in their recliners and puttered around while they could and then just stopped. And I remember thinking, oh no, no, no. That is not my that is not my plan for retire. My plan, it's it's really more about just being finished with the being in the classroom. And now what can I do? I want to, I want to travel, I want to see the world. I I've done some good travel already, but I have a long list of other places I want to see.

Fletch 31:27

Sherry, you just said the magic word here for the Mango Times. You use the word adventure. And and that's really what I'm hoping as people face retirement, as people face, you know, major life 90-degree corners, that they look at it as adventure with curiosity as well. And it sounds like that's your sweet spot right now.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

1000%. Absolutely. I like I said, I have a hard time saying no to almost anything interesting. I I know I remember reading a study, somebody interviewed people in nursing homes, like who are nearing the end of their lives, and asked them what their regrets were. And over and over and over, their regrets were the things they didn't do. And I remember hearing that and reading about that long, long time ago, and thinking, I I'm gonna say yes to everything I can say yes to now, and not just now, but always. Why why why wait? Why work, work, work so that when I retire, what happens if I can't do the things I want to do when I retire? Who knows what could happen? So I have gotten into a big habit over the last, I'd say 10 years, of having as much adventure as I can squeeze into breaks and as much as I can afford and saying yes.

Finding The Window After Loss

Fletch 32:48

Well, I want to wrap this up with some wisdom for our listeners from you, Sherry. So, what would you say to someone whose version of the world religions course just got voted out, whatever that looks like in their life? What would you say to them?

SPEAKER_02 33:03

When a door closes, a window opens, right? So you can't just sit there in the room and feel sorry for yourself because the door just slammed in your face. You have to find a way out. And I think if you look hard enough, you might see that there's a window and you can probably get out that way. There's a lot out there. You don't have to you don't have to live by the rules that someone makes for you. You can make your own rules, you can make your own path, you can make your own choices and make your life look the way you want it to look.

Fletch 33:33

So you taught kids that fear comes from ignorance. Is there anything, Sherry, that you're still afraid of?

SPEAKER_02 33:40

Every day I'm afraid. Every day I'm afraid of not knowing what's gonna happen tomorrow. Nobody knows. And that's something I work on every day. But the fear of what could happen, that I would love for that to go away. I don't know if it will. Human being, right? It's hard. We're all afraid of what we don't know and understand. But I think I think the peace of just being satisfied in the moment is my goal.

Fletch 34:08

And then lastly, I don't know where I'll put this in the interview, but is there anything you wish you would have done sooner?

SPEAKER_02 34:14

Nope, that falls into the whole regret thing. And I I believe regret is is poison. You can't I I teach this to my students. I say you can't, you can't live your life feeling bad about the things you did. Take it as a lesson. I'm a teacher. Lessons are what I'm all about. Take every bad choice you've ever made and make it a lesson and learn from it and make different choices in the future. And you have just turned a bad choice into a lesson, and how can I argue with that as a teacher? So if I could have done anything earlier, I think it would have been out of order in my life. I think everything happened the way it did. If you're satisfied with where you're standing, you can't second guess the steps that got you there.

Fletch 35:01

Alright, then one more bonus question, because I think this one's fun. I'm gonna give you a soapbox for just a second to talk to parents of kids in high school. What do you want to say to those parents?

SPEAKER_02 35:13

Not everyone goes to college. Not everyone is made for a classroom experience. And some do later. I did not go to college right after high school. I did lots of other things before I woke up one day and said, Oh, I think I need to go to college. Um, so support your kids in what their passions are. If their passion doesn't look like your view of what it should look like, then you just need to give them all the love and and support and understanding and patience that you can.

Fast Five And Closing Thoughts

Fletch 35:52

All right. Now the famous Mingo Times Fast Five questions that I love to ask people.

SPEAKER_01 35:57

Okay, okay, all right.

Fletch 35:58

You don't get to think, you just get to answer fast. So first thing that comes to your mind. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:03

Okay.

Fletch 36:04

All right, first thing that comes to your mind, number one, morning person or night owl?

SPEAKER_02 36:09

Night. Definitely night. Definitely night.

Fletch 36:12

Number two, coffee, tea, or something stronger by 5 p.m.

SPEAKER_02 36:17

Oh, it's five o'clock somewhere, right? So we have a clock on our patio in the backyard that's set to five o'clock. The the clock died, but we just set it at five o'clock and left it there. That way it's five o'clock. Right? Yeah, that's perfect. And so the something stronger would be absolutely a wonderful whiskey to just sit up and enjoy.

Fletch 36:41

All right, your favorite place to escape when you need a reset.

SPEAKER_02 36:45

I was born in San Diego and grew up in the Bay Area. Get me close to the ocean and I'm good.

Fletch 36:51

Do you have a favorite beach?

SPEAKER_02 36:53

Monterey. I love to be anywhere in Monterey. I have a favorite hotel and a favorite room in that hotel that overlooks the beach.

Fletch 37:01

All right, a book, podcast, or Netflix, what's your go-to?

SPEAKER_02 37:05

I love podcasts. And I know I'm not just saying it because we're sitting here doing one, but I have a huge collection of podcasts in my library, and it helps me sleep listening to people talk. I love listening to audiobooks. I think I just like sitting back and being and enjoyed listening to the voices and the stories. I love being I love hearing a good story.

Fletch 37:29

All right, then last one. If you're not teaching anymore, what's the one thing you would try to do just for fun?

SPEAKER_02 37:36

Anything that involves travel. Anything. I want to spend a couple of months in Italy. There's too many things I want to see for a trip. I want to pretend like I live there. So that's that's kind of a big goal of mine.

Fletch 37:50

So, Sherry, if someone wants to reach out to you, if they I'm gonna put in the show notes your TEDx talk, I'll put in the links to Amazon Prime. But if someone wanted to reach you, if you got to them and they said I'd like to reach out and talk to her, what's the best way they can reach you?

SPEAKER_02 38:05

Oh, they can email me. I would assume uh I need to stop using my work email because it won't be mine anymore as of May 30th. So my personal email that I can I can share with you.

Fletch 38:17

I'll put that in the show notes as well. All right. Well, one of the things that came up a lot in this interview and came in our notes as we went back and forth to one another is you like to say yes to things. So I want to thank you for saying yes to being on the Mango Times podcast and just spending this time with me and with my audience. Thanks for being here.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

Oh, you're welcome. Thanks. I enjoyed it. Thank you very much.

Fletch 38:42

Hey, I want to thank Sherry again for joining me on this interview. You know, she spent 25 years teaching kids that we're prejudiced towards the things that we don't understand, and that the antidote to fear is knowledge. You know, it turns out that lesson applies to our own next chapters as well, because we're afraid of what we don't know yet. And maybe the only way through is to actually get curious about it, and like she said, find that way through the next window. And sometimes that window is high, and you need a ladder or you need help figuring it out. That's why I'm doing these interviews. That's why I'm taking the time to kind of learn what other people have done or what they're thinking about or how they're curious about their third act. Hey, if this episode hit home with you, uh there's the link in the show notes where you can reach me, you can send me a text, or as I mentioned, you can now send a voicemail. And here's the fun part. I can actually include your voice on the show. So if you're in a transition, or if you're staring one down, or if you know someone who would be great on the podcast, I'd love to hear from you. So just scroll down your notes and connect with me with either text or voicemail. And in the meantime, if you're in the middle of an adventure or just curious about the next stage, why don't you do me a favor and hop on with me? And let's get out there and quietly make some noise. You've been listening to the Mango Times Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 40:28

I was expecting to see a pipe and and a cup of coffee.

Fletch 40:33

Well, water today. I've already had like three cups of coffee. I'm a little caffeined out, but nicotine, I'm a little low.